Judith Schwartz’s engaging new memoir, The Therapist’s New Clothes, tells a poignant story of losing faith. It’s about her disillusionment with psychotherapy, a belief system she’d put all of her faith into, and then rebuilding a stronger confidence in herself. Here’s my conversation with Schwartz about losing her faith, and regaining it:
Jennifer: Tell me about your faith in psychotherapy.
Judith: For much of my life, my entire belief system revolved around whatever my therapist told me. I was hooked. Regular sessions helped me manage what I now know is a mood disorder (mixed anxiety and depression). Plus, my therapists assured me that once I “worked things through” I would no longer feel bad. This gave me something to hold onto. When I was shaky or in despair I could remind myself of my future deliverance: as soon as I swept out the cobwebs in my unconscious I’d be fine.
Jennifer: And, you became a therapist yourself.
Judith: After I published a book and wasn’t sure what I wanted to do with myself I thought, “Hey, why not be a therapist?” I mean, who knew more about therapy than me? This accelerated the spiral I was already in. I saw that I could help people, but my own emotional pattern would not budge. Yet how could I give up therapy? It had become my whole life. Finally, after things got so bad I had to do something, I managed to wrench myself away—and got my life back.
Jennifer: In The Therapist’s New Clothes, you talk candidly about your own increasingly difficult psychotherapy treatment. How hard was this to write about?
Judith: Some of it was extremely difficult and some material I couldn’t even touch until the third or fourth draft. But writing the book also helped me make sense of the experience and put it behind me, which was very freeing.
Jennifer: Do you still have faith in psychotherapy?
Judith: What I have faith in is the possibility of transformation through relationship. That can certainly be in the context of psychotherapy, though not necessarily.
Jennifer: What advice can you give people who are considering psychotherapy in choosing a therapist?
Judith: Don’t give one person too much power over you. And make sure you’ve got some reality checks. If someone says you seem less happy since starting therapy, listen. Don’t simply accept the idea that you have to feel bad in order to get better. I should have realized I was in trouble when I was making excuses for my therapy. “Oh, I’m just in a rough patch now. I just need to get through this.” I was like an addict–oh, just one more drink.
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I too became a counselor but I start each session explaining that the client is the authority on his/her own life, that I’m here as a mechanic with tools- some will work some won’t and it’s the client’s job to determine and communicate if anything is working. We are partners with the object to put me out of business in their life. I am not going to make you my only source of income for the rest of my life. Everyone can use extra feedback and education and I feel much better about my place in their life.
The therapy “partnership” is a tricky one, and I like your philosophy of being a mechanic! I agree with Judith that big problems can happen when the therapist has too much weight in the relationship, too much control. I had a therapist once who tried making it impossible for me to leave therapy. It was a really scary situation when I was at one of my most vulnerable times in life. I hate to put it this way, but “luckily” she had to quit practicing b/c of a medical condition and referred me to a wonderful therapist whose goal is also to put himself out of business in his clients’ lives–and he did that with me.
Reading this interview was at once painful and hopeful. Painful because Judith’s story brings up the sadness (–often prolonged) we endure when we look outside ourselves for our truth (I think about this and write about it, too, but not in relation to therapy – though I have been in therapy, and am a LCSW). What’s hopeful is her discovery of transformation through relationship, and her ability to put it into words on the page. The moment of awakening she had must have been amazing. I am excited to read this book. Thanks for such an insightful interview, Jen.
Great and practical advice in this interview, particularly the part where it’s recommended not to give the therapist (or anyone, really) too much power over you. I know so many people who have been seeing the same therapist for 10 years or more and I see that they have the same troubles since they started therapy. It seems that they are expecting the therapist to do something to help them. And yet the therapist doesn’t seem willing to tell the patient that things need to change on their end. The book sounds interesting and I’m hoping to get it.
This looks like a really interesting book. You don’t see a lot of people debunking therapy.
this was interesting. I went to therapy for the first time in the past year when I was going through some rough times…and I wrangle with its value the same way I wrangle with my faith (lack of? I don’t even know anymore..)…the book sounds interesting.
Thanks for bringing my attention to this book. Sounds fascinating. I’d been to so many therapists in my lifetime but never found the right match–the one that could help me become accountable–until a turning point in my life that instantly changed the way I saw myself. That was when I knew I had changes to make and sought out someone who could do cognitive therapy. In other words, she gave me work to do that put the onus on me to make changes I needed, really to become aware. That was the secret for me. It allowed me to do what Judith says here, not to hand over power to someone else. Good point made–on many fronts. I’ll go find this book. Thanks!
this is so amazingly true I have one Child God gave us after trying infertility and then adoption and it took us 10 years and alot of money and I had all these plans We were going to do and then I listened to My Friends with all there busy Kids, Husband and themselves and said wait aminute You only have this minute for a minute don’t blow it and now My Son is 13 and His Friends come over a few I overheard talking and they said ” —– You are so lucky You have time to crash and hang out and enjoy Your Mom and Dad We are always in the van or at something else Wow You are so lucky We are always doing driveups and being late” You have nothing but school this week and You do PJ day I have never done that” I then knew We were doing what was perfect for Our family of 3
I’ve had a few therapists each relationship ended with growth. I have depression, so continuing therapy was necessary at times, UNTIL my last therapist. After a year I was totally controlled by her until my friends and family made me aware I was always depressed. It was a painful parting for me, after a year I’ve made many changes and turned to God. I am better than I’ve ever been and know I will continue this way. I am looking forward to your book & advise all to never become their ‘friend’ as that’s when I put my life in her hands.
God has saved me.